The Orange Islands Regional Revamp Project

Discussion in 'RPG News & Discussion' started by Zenith, Aug 16, 2011.

  1. Angel Knight Phil

    Angel Knight Phil Drag-on Dragoon Pummelo Moderator

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    And Christina...

    [50] :female: :volcronic: 197/197 [Intimidate]
    [51] :male: :manaton: 185/185 [Unaware]
    [51] :female: :clarimata: 200/200 [Forewarn]
    [52] :male: :riogua: 249/249 [Serene Grace]
    [53] :female: :ferazon: 213/213 [Intimidate]

    [X] :female: :volcronic: [Intimidate]
    [X] :male: :manaton: [Sap Sipper]
    [X] :female: :clarimata: [Adaptability]
    [X] :male: :riogua: [Serene Grace]
    [X] :male: :infernape: [Blaze]
    [X] :female: :ferazon: [Rock Head]
     
  2. Timeblaze

    Timeblaze I'm supposed to hold it by the sharp end, right?

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    Those teams all look good, but I'm not too sure about Gazalaxy remaining as Linsay's ace, especially with Draether on the same team. I think it'd be better if Draether and Gazalaxy swapped positions on her team. It makes more thematic sense anyways, as Joshua's new ace is a Terrelta.
     
  3. Angel Knight Phil

    Angel Knight Phil Drag-on Dragoon Pummelo Moderator

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    Only kept Gazalaxy as the ace because of the dual type, but I see your point. Draether is way too powerful to not be the ace there. Then I remembered it was dual dragon/fairy trainer instead of being dark/fairy, so yeah.

    Just tweaked Lindsay a bit.

    [50] :male: :centilisk: 182/182 [Intimidate]
    [51] :female: :apollyonf: 226/226 [Intimidate]
    [51] :female: :ryumulus: 200/200 [Natural Cure]
    [52] :male: :gazalaxy: 184/184 [Insomnia]
    [53] :female: :draether: 197/197 [Cloud Nine]

    [X] :female: :klefki: [Prankster]
    [X] :male: :kingdra: [Swift Swim]
    [X] :female: :solidra: [Serene Grace]
    [X] :male: :haxorus: [Mold Breaker]
    [X] :female: :noivern: [Infiltrator]
    [X] :female: :draether: [Serene Grace]

    And also Drake:

    [54] :male: :aureon: 206/206 [Protean]
    [55] :female: :nessamore: 259/259 [Water Absorb]
    [56] :female: :absogno: 219/219 [Pressure]
    [57] :female: :nebulion: 206/206 [Volt Absorb]
    [58] :male: :flarios: 215/215 [Serene Grace]
    [59] :female: :karozur: 242/242 [Battle Armor]

    [X] :male: :greninja: [Protean]
    [X] :male: :aureon: [Protean]
    [X] :male: :flarios: [Fire Power]
    [X] :mewka: [Adaptability]
    [X] :female: :machamp: [No Guard]
    [X] :female: :karozur: [Moxie]
     
  4. Haas

    Haas The Master of the Night Administrator

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    I like those teams a lot. And for the Ghost/Normal teams (forgot the name), is there a problem having the Water/Ghost Suicune thing? (names amirite) Because I think that would add more variety.
     
  5. Phoenixsong

    Phoenixsong Is okay. Obby is often used as punishment.

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    It would also add a legendary where there isn't really a good thematic reason for one. And not even to the champion, to boot. Honestly even the glitchmon seem a little "just because" to me, but leaving them off introduces even more variety issues in some teams so I can live with it.

    Full support for a pick-your-poison E4, and those teams look good to me.
     
  6. Roxas

    Roxas Prince of the Stars Administrator

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    and suddenly I don't want to CA through OI anymore.

    I approve.
     
  7. Angel Knight Phil

    Angel Knight Phil Drag-on Dragoon Pummelo Moderator

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    Glitchmon were added because they were a decent part of the OI/Zeralis plot, so they feel native to me.

    Also, AB added Spiragua to Ricardo, but since I didn't give Drake's CA team Ellaith like I originally planned to do (double Protean though), I didn't feel another member should get a legendary.

    Did we make CA teams for the rest of the GLs?
     
  8. Haas

    Haas The Master of the Night Administrator

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    They all have them in their gym threads
     
  9. Chimera

    Chimera Minor Junior Private Negative First Class

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    Feel like Pearduck might be a better fit on Drake than Nessamore (...especially with Multiscale shenanigans afoot, because if you're going to make these teams impossible you might as well go the distance). Everything looks good otherwise, and I look forward to never having the need to face off against these rosters in the future.

    So I forgot this was going to be a thing. Motion to reopen discussion of gym teams from Dimitri to...well, as far as the shaken-up level curve would extend. Danny? Jason? Might as well get OI tied up in a neat little bow before we go tackle Zeralis.
     
  10. Roxas

    Roxas Prince of the Stars Administrator

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    Danny's team.

    Can we talk about how Danny's team is completely OP now.
     
  11. Chimera

    Chimera Minor Junior Private Negative First Class

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    *goes to look at Danny's team*

    ...

    Oh. Um. There's really no middle ground between "pitifully easy" and "why do I keep dying" for Ice gym leaders, is there?

    ...well, if we bump down the level curve on Dimitri and Cissy, we can probably make Danny a bit easier in the process. Was thinking something like 10-12 (combined with a slight cutting of the Triplets' levels) and 14-16 for Cissy. Can adjust Alyssa and Danny to lesser degrees from there, but the early gyms are the priority: cut out the grind there, members won't get bored of the grind and leave early on.
     
  12. Timeblaze

    Timeblaze I'm supposed to hold it by the sharp end, right?

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    If Cissy's team was nerfed down to 14-16, then she'd have to find a new ace, as lowering Serince down that far beyond its evolution level is really pushing it. Lv. 21 was already crossing the line. And we couldn't use Siron, as you can just catch that on the first route of the game, so it's nowhere near suitable to being the 2nd Gym Leader's ace.
     
  13. Chimera

    Chimera Minor Junior Private Negative First Class

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    It's a good thing the ZeralisDex is just chock full of Water-types, then! Telazure could work - a bit below evo threshold, but not a lot - or something like Vaporeon, Lunarion (mostly iffy because Dark-type right after Dark gym) or Pikablu. There are possibilities.
     
  14. Angel Knight Phil

    Angel Knight Phil Drag-on Dragoon Pummelo Moderator

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    Cute Charm Telazure would be my suggestion.
     
  15. Chimera

    Chimera Minor Junior Private Negative First Class

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    After realizing that Water Pressure has a 20% chance of inflicting paralysis normally, and Telazure can get Serene Grace, I concur with Cute Charm Telazure. So something like...

    [14] :sygnal: [Water Absorb]
    [15] :chinchou: [Volt Absorb]
    [16] :telazure: [Cute Charm]

    Still a tough team (it also steals the Hax Crown from Dimitri, who's definitely losing Paradisea), but much easier to deal with just by playing to type advantages with stuff you can catch in the Grapefruit Islands (Chitang, Gloli, Psibian, etc.). And for Dimitri...

    [10] :lemaul: [Defiant]
    [12] :emblit: [Sheer Force]

    Could at least put up a fight if Emblit keeps early-level Incinerate, but by and large manageable if you're not severely underleveled. Lunelle's another option for Dimitri as a non-ace (since ace status means no Gaza on Lindsay because stealing someone's ace is a no-no), but I prefer Suddenly Lemaul because it makes Dimitri seem more threatening, even though it's a pure physical attacker and the gym TM is special.

    (And behold, we just made the early game so much easier that new members might actually stick around! Now we just have to do the same for Amaya...but that's for its own thread.)
     
  16. Zenith

    Zenith No Ordinary Swordsman

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    Heh, I think I remember talk a while back in chat about a few of these changes. I specifically remember people wanting to change Cissy's ace to Telazure, which I'm definitely for.

    ...However...I think her team's levels could be just a little stronger than that. I get the need to cut down on early region level grinding, and I see how there's only one route between Tarroco and Mikan, but there's still some room for growth in that time + any missions players take on in the mean time. Easier is one thing, but setting up a situation where someone comes into the city with a party near even with the gym leader's ruins the chance for said gym leader to be a decent challenge. I mean, hell, even Bugsy and Roxie have rosters at higher levels! It couldn't hurt to move Cissy's into the 16-18 range, could it?

    Dimitri, on the other hand, could really use the proposed level nerf. But...I dunno if he really needs to lose Paradisea.

    ...Hear me out. Please.

    Dimitri's Paradisea has been infamous for catching people off guard, has it not? Her strength was always her element of surprise, how much of a fight she put up early on. Thing is, though, how much of that was pure hax and how much was from players being underprepared, or facing Dimitri too early? The kind of problem that'd be better solved by nerfing the levels of Dimitri's team, something we're already doing? And as part of it, his Paradisea wouldn't have Feint Attack any longer, meaning she's limited to only Special STAB and can get at least checked by anything with decent SpD, and was one of the few single-stage lines to stick to its original BST, a not-all-that-strong 440.

    But this might be making a mountain out of a molehill, you might say. Why not just let Dimitri get an Emblit ace and be easier?

    Because right now, that Emblit would be more one-dimensional than Paradisea.

    Thanks to Gen VI doubling Incinerate's strength, Emblit currently has 60 BP STAB at Level 1--something that probably won't survive the Gen VI revamp, but might still be on the line's set before Level 12. That alone doesn't push Emblit into red flag territory, though...it's when Sheer Force gets involved, trading an effect that'd see almost no use this early in the region for even more power. Combine that with STAB, and you have a move with an effective BP of 117 in the first gym.

    The current "outlast the hax bird" strategy for beating Dimitri gets a lot easier just by making his Paradisea lower leveled...and it leaves more room for creativity than "have something that resists Fire or you're screwed".
     
  17. Phoenixsong

    Phoenixsong Is okay. Obby is often used as punishment.

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    Eh? Sheer force wouldn't affect incinerate. Sheer force only affects moves that have a secondary effect (a.k.a. % chance to trigger, even if that chance is 100% like mud-slap or zap cannon), not moves that have any effect at all besides doing damage. It'd still be decently strong, but certainly not that bad. Emblit doesn't get any moves that are boosted by sheer force until flame wheel as it stands.
     
  18. Timeblaze

    Timeblaze I'm supposed to hold it by the sharp end, right?

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    I am in agreement with Zenith to change Cissy's level range to 16-18. Lv. 16 is way too low for a 2nd Gym Leader's ace, and the only canon 2nd Gym Leader to be even close to that range was Bugsy. And as we all know, that was only because Johto's level curve was so slow due to having to squeeze Kanto in there too.

    So maybe something like this.

    [16] :sygnal: [Water Absorb]
    [17] :chinchou: [Volt Absorb]
    [18] :telazure: [Cute Charm]

    As for the whole Emblit vs. Paradisea, I don't care too much either way. While Emblit's Incinerate is indeed stronger than Paradisea's Gust, Paradisea's got a stronger Shadow Bind, so it sort of balances out.
     
  19. Haas

    Haas The Master of the Night Administrator

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    I say just keep it as Emblit because it is much easier to catch a water type to counter Emblit than a type to counter paradisea
     
  20. Kitsune_XIII

    Kitsune_XIII Composer Ampereon

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    I'm for removing Paradisea, because yes, it was primarily the crit haxing that fucked over new players for Dimitri. And with the new crit system they'll be critted even more often, with nothing that can reliably counter Paradisea at that point to make up for it unless they B-day promo something. Which uses up the B-day promo for something that the person might actually want to use long term.

    After the triplets and Ivy, most early players figured out pretty quick that "No, no I can't challenge the important trainers as soon as I step foot in this place I actually need to train".


    Similarly, we really shouldn't count the potential for missions being done in the gym rosters, because not everyone is going to join a team, and even if they do, there's absolutely no guarantee that they'll do said missions. They're entirely optional.
     

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